Shout Out - Our MS Ministry Team

Would you allow me a second to brag on our stumin staff, especially those who serve middle school?

Merge AM is our new Sunday morning worship experience for middle school students. With a lot of prayer, vision and work, Trey and Shea have done a wonderful job developing, communicating and implementing great programming on Sunday morning.

Our hope has always been we would meet new middle school students on Sunday morning and connect them to lifegroups on Sunday night. Yes, “life on life” small groups have been and will continue to be the foundation of our programming.

It’s happening! And not only are we meeting new students but Trey, Shea and our volunteer leaders are creating amazing environment for growing in Christ and connecting in community.

Please continue to pray for our middle school ministry staff and volunteers at IBC. They’re intimately involved in the lives of young people and families at an exciting yet challenging stage of life.

Quote for the Day - "I will be their God"

"Dwell in the light of thy Lord, and let they soul be always ravished with his love.
Get out the marrow and fatness which this portion yields thee.
Live up to thy privileges, and rejoice with unspeakable joy."

Spurgeon

Question of the Day

"Why is there something rather than nothing?"

It's a question of why not what which leads me to believe it's more of a philosophical / religious question rather than a scientific question.

Nevertheless, Stephen Hawking (famous scientist) is tackling the question on the Discovery Channel this Sunday night.

How would you answer the question?

Please Pray

Please pray for our students.

Last night Jha’Kyric Nixon drowned while at a birthday party for one of our students. He was around most Wednesday nights, he was one of us.

I spent a couple hours with students and parents at my house last night praying and remembering. They’re confused, sad, shocked, feel guilty and angry. They also have hope he is with Jesus.

Pray for comfort for his family.
Pray that students might see God clearly through the fog of loss.
Pray that God would take tragedy and turn it for his glory and our good. That’s what he does.

And really, please pray, even if just for a minute. There is so much at stake at times like this. The wall between the physical and spiritual feels paper thin.

David

SWAG - New High School Gathering

Yes, we're starting a new gathering for high school students. And yes it's called SWAG. No, it may not be the name you or I would have chosen but the students chose it and seem to love it.

There will be a teaching team involved so I decided to gather some thoughts and values to get our speakers on the same page. Here's what I sent them.


Hey SWAG speakers! Thanks for using your giftedness to present truth to high school students. Here are a few thoughts to consider as you begin your prep.

1. We want to encourage and challenge the hearts of our students who follow Jesus, but also communicate as if there are many students in the room who don’t understand and embrace the gospel. We can’t assume they know anything about the Bible or the gospel. As believing students walk away our desire is that they would want to expose their searching friends to SWAG.

2. Our hope is that the communication will be interactive. We’re setting up ways for the students to text questions. Normally we hope to have a short question and answer time following each talk. Don’t worry, we’ll filter the questions but be ready to answer and be willing to say, “that’s a great question, I have no idea”. We’re not there to “know it all”.

3. We want to be creative. Creativity usually takes time to develop and pull together. As speakers let’s try to get way ahead of the game so those juices can flow! You don’t have to be creative alone, our producer, Joel Gwartney is going to be a great asset to the creativity.

4. I know I’m preaching to the choir, but vulnerability is so crucial. As speakers we’re not up with all the answers, we’re on a journey seeking to understand and embrace what it means to follow Jesus. When appropriate jump at the opportunity to share personal struggle and doubt. As you do, students will see you as a real person not just an old person.

5. Let’s use our Bibles. Although there will be many students who don’t believe the Bible, it’s still true that God’s Word is powerful. We’re not avoiding truth, simply presenting it in a humble / whimsical fashion.

6. Let’s be gospel centered. I know, that can mean so many things. Here’s the deal, students don’t need more rules and encouragement to simply be better. What they need is the life transforming work of Jesus. If there is practical application in your talk make sure you focus on the example and power of Jesus doing it in and through students, not simply asking them to “try harder”. It’s the gospel that changes lives, not pure effort.

7. Have fun! Speaking at SWAG should be a blast, but let’s keep it to less than 25 minutes. So don’t’ have too much fun!

Again, thanks so much for being a part. We are eagerly expecting that God is going to use you to impact the hearts of high school students.

Beach Camp 2011

This morning at 6:30am sharp 2 charter buses, 3 fifteen passenger vans and one food truck (driven by our cook, Pat O’Reilly) left IBC for Gulf Shores, Alabama.

Our purpose? Beach Camp 2011!

For some reason God seems to work in special ways at camp. A good friend of mine once said that camp is “life the way God intended”. It has consistent time alone with Him, time in community, fun, worship and great teaching. (and again this year, Bob Downy’s Brisket)

This year we’re focusing on the idea of “mission”. We hope students will understand that mission isn’t simply something you do, it’s more who you are. It’s about loving, serving and bringing the presence of Christ to whomever God puts you in your path. Whether it’s Honduras, downtown Dallas or your Algebra 2 class, people need to experience the love and grace of Jesus.

Please be in prayer for us. Our hope is that students experience deep and authentic change that will also impact our area campuses.

And really, we need prayer.

Thanks

Love / Hate Relationship With Student Mission Trips

I’m struggling with something. It’s a good struggle I would like to explore and discuss with others smarter than me. We are called to serve those who are hurting which I desperately want to do. It’s also a great thing to take students with us to serve. But what if in our attempt to serve we simply serve ourselves without helping those who are hurting?

As I write I'm in Camoyagua, Honduras on the last day of a short-term mission trip. I'm with a team of 14 students and 5 adults serving in an orphanage as well as other places. Our goal is simple, be the hands and feet of Jesus by “visiting the orphans in their affliction”.

There's no doubt the love of Jesus has been shown to a group of children who need it desperately. They are hungry for love and affection but also food. Yes, they’re literally hungry. There’s no doubt our being here has encouraged and helped others with basic needs. I’m so proud of our team. They have made a profound impact on these people, but even coming off this great experience I’m still processing short-term trips and their effectiveness.

First of all let me say this; I wholeheartedly reject the philosophy that says trips should be planned primarily for the students who are traveling and not really for the people they are serving. If that is the case it seems we're being very foolish with a lot of time, energy and money. If our primary goal and strategy is set on the hearts of our students we cease to have an authentic mission. There are less expensive ways to challenge the hearts of our kids.

Being purposeful is essential if ministry effectiveness somewhat matches the time, energy and money spent. I know the issues are complex and you can’t simply quantify results but we can work hard to make the experience as beneficial as possible. Beneficial for those we are serving which will result in growth for our students.

As I’m living in the tension allow me to share some thoughts…

1. The experience must be utterly authentic

Students want to make a lasting impact. If they’re on a trip that is primarily designed to serve them instead of giving them authentic opportunities to serve, they will know the difference and be frustrated. Also, if all our thinking and planning is about serving the needs of our students we will miss great opportunity to impact the world.

The last thing I want to do is take students on an expensive sight seeing trip and call it missions. There is enough need in our neighborhoods and world that can be met with passionate students. Let’s be careful to find those needs.

2. We should think long and hard before doing construction

The orphanage we are serving needs some buildings finished so more children can be housed and enjoy better facilities. We could get a team here to “knock it out” in a week or two. That would be awesome, or would it?

To bring a team here might cost $20,000 plus materials. For locals to do the work it would cost less than $10,000 and they would do a better job. There is 35% unemployment in Honduras. If we came and did the work it would be stealing needed work for those who are here. Is that really serving the people of Honduras well?

Of course there are exceptions, but if the purpose of mission is to glorify God by serving the needs of people we have to make sure what we’re doing serves them…not just us. So, if the only way to get something done is for us to do it, let’s go. If we can serve better in different ways, let’s stay out of the way.

3. Our students will naturally be impacted as they serve

Of course there is a great possibility our students will get receive far more than they give, but that shouldn’t dominate our planning and purpose.

This afternoon I'm meeting with Holly and her husband Alex. Holly first visited Honduras in 1996 on a youth mission trip. God used that trip to draw her heart to Central America. I’m thankful for that trip 15 years ago.

As I sat around the circle with my students last night I couldn't help but wonder how God might use this trip to create greater compassion in their hearts. Compassion and calling that may be used to impact the world with the gospel. It's not the number one goal but it inevitably happens when we obey Jesus' command to serve the "least of these".

It’s exciting to hear our students share what God has done in their heart on this trip. I’m thankful for his work in their lives and look forward to how that carries over into their everyday life.

It’s ok to expect our students to get more than they receive, in my opinion however that should not be the main goal.

4. Consider using a mission organization

Wonder Voyage is supporting my team, which is a ministry that creates custom opportunities for student groups. They do an incredible job working with the youth pastor to create an experience, which meets the unique needs and desires of a particular group. They also provide a person on the ground to help with logistical and spiritual needs. They’ll help as much or as little as you want.

For years I planned and carried out trips by myself but after going on my first trip led by Wonder Voyage not only did I save a tremendous amount of time, it freed me to be relational with the students on the trip. So whether it’s YWAM, Youthworks or Wonder Voyage, consider using someone to help you with your mission experience.

After thinking about the way our students served Honduras I’m more convinced than ever that we must unleash students to serve the world. It’s part of my responsibility as a pastor to help them leverage their gifts and passions to reach the world with the gospel knowing it will change them as well.

Each of us is leaving Honduras changed, that’s great. My greater hope is that children and others have experienced the hands and feet of Jesus in a way leads to his fame and worship.

I’m all ears, what do you think?

Adios…

Quote of the day

If you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge a ball...

Quote of the Day

The grace of God through Jesus Christ our Lord must be understood as follows: grace is the only thing that delivers human beings from evil; without it, they do absolutely nothing good, whether in thought, or in will and emotion, or in action. Grace not only makes known to people what they ought to do, but also enables them to perform with love the duty that they know.

Augustine

Pure

When I was 9 my friends and I hit the jackpot. Messing around in the woods around our neighborhood we found a white plastic bag filled with Penthouse magazines. We where blown away by what we saw!

I'm not sure how much or how little the "jackpot" contributed, but that summer I began a life long struggle with issues of purity. I actually thought that when I turned 40 I would have been totally "set free" from temptation and struggle, that is simply not the case. Even today I have to be so careful not to allow a foothold for potential temptation.

God has been so gracious, I've never been involved in "scandalous" sin that would jeopardize my family or ministry but I do have a deep desire to grow in this area of purity.

I ran across something I wrote for myself several years back to help me battle impurity. It's very practical but also includes verbiage to remind me of the truth. Please, please don't see this as a moralistic attempt to do better. My hearts desire was to lean more into Jesus but also do some "no brainer" things to place me in a position to grow in grace.

It's raw and was designed for my particular situation at that time. Perhaps it will encourage you to design your own thoughts in this area.


Purity Action Plan

Titus 2:11-14
11 For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. 12 It teaches us to say "No" to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, 13 while we wait for the blessed hope-the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good.

God has given us his grace to “tutor” us to say no to impurity. Although the process of becoming more and more pure is an act of God’s grace, he has given us wisdom and common sense by his grace to think through how to battle temptation. Dependence on rule and regulation does nothing to assist us in the battle against lust but it is wise to think through an intentional plan to utilize the gifts of God’s grace.

The following is an attempt, hopefully motivated by God’s grace, to grow in the area of personal purity. The following plan should be put into place immediately and be carefully followed for 2 months. At that time it might be wise to adjust and or change portions of the action plan. The plan should be shared with accountability partners who will daily and then weekly ask specific questions that relate to the plan. It is assumed that the person seeking greater purity will be honest in answering questions most the time.

What to do…

• Memorize and meditate on the following passages…

Prov 5:3-6
3 For the lips of an adulteress drip honey,
and her speech is smoother than oil;
4 but in the end she is bitter as gall,
sharp as a double-edged sword.
5 Her feet go down to death;
her steps lead straight to the grave.
6 She gives no thought to the way of life;
her paths are crooked, but she knows it not.

Rom 6:11-14
11 In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus. 12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its evil desires. 13 Do not offer the parts of your body to sin, as instruments of wickedness, but rather offer yourselves to God, as those who have been brought from death to life; and offer the parts of your body to him as instruments of righteousness. 14 For sin shall not be your master, because you are not under law, but under grace.


2 Tim 2:22-23
22 Flee the evil desires of youth, and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, along with those who call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

Heb 13:4-5
4 Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.

1 Cor 6:12-20
12 "Everything is permissible for me"-but not everything is beneficial. "Everything is permissible for me"-but I will not be mastered by anything. 13 "Food for the stomach and the stomach for food"-but God will destroy them both. The body is not meant for sexual immorality, but for the Lord, and the Lord for the body. 14 By his power God raised the Lord from the dead, and he will raise us also. 15 Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ himself? Shall I then take the members of Christ and unite them with a prostitute? Never! 16 Do you not know that he who unites himself with a prostitute is one with her in body? For it is said, "The two will become one flesh." 17 But he who unites himself with the Lord is one with him in spirit.

18 Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own body. 19 Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20 you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body.

Job 31:1
"I made a covenant with my eyes
not to look lustfully at a girl.

Matt 5:27-30
27 "You have heard that it was said, 'Do not commit adultery.' 28 But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 29 If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell.

• Call David and or Joe every night at 10:00 until August 27th

• Daily pray that God would “create in me a clean heart”

• Call David and or Joe during more vulnerable times
o Before times of heavy responsibility
o After times of spiritual victory
o When I notice an extra attraction to women around me
o When I am feeling rejected by Julie and or others
o Times of travel

• Strive to be diligent in normal disciplines

• Set parental controls on T.V. in our bedroom

• Seek to serve Julie and pursue her romantically

What to avoid…

• T.V. past 11 if everyone is in bed

• Computer past 11

Again, this was for me in that particular time in my journey. The issue of purity is important enough for each of us to take the time and energy to think and pray through how we should deal with this area of temptation. Our family, ministry and intimacy with Jesus are worth the time and attention.

Summer Intern Orientation

Rough notes on what we're sharing with our summer interns and staff tonight.

Summer Intern Orientation…

1. It’s about the Heart (C.H. Spurgeon quote)

“How diligently the calvary officer keeps his sabre clean and sharp; every stain he rubs off with the greatest care. Remember you are God's sword, His instrument – I trust, a chosen vessel unto Him to bear His name. In great measure, according to the purity and perfection of the instrument will be the success. It is not great talents God blesses as much as likeness to Jesus. A holy minister is an awful weapon in the hand of God”.
The most important thing you can do this summer is care for your own heart.

• What are some ways you grow personally? You need both the table and the chair.
• Are you a writer? Take time to write what God is doing in your life and how he is using you.
• Attend “big church”
• God answers prayer
• Seek to experience God in the small things

2. It’s about the relationships
a. Build deep relationships with students you are naturally drawn towards
b. Use your “left hand” to build relationships with students who are a little more difficult to connect with. Actively pursue those who are on the peripheral.
c. Be creative and cheap with your activities.
d. Kidding around can get out of hand real fast and damage potential influence
e. Us your words to build up. Students rarely hear positive affirmation consistently.

3. It’s about wisdom
a. When in doubt be conservative
i. If there’s a question about what you’re doing the answer should typically be “don’t do it”. If you need to ask someone’s advice do it.
ii. Have deep relationships, but keep wise boundaries in those relationships.
1. Careful about driving someone of the opposite sex.
2. Careful about one on one time with opposite sex.
iii. Think about what you put on facebook
iv. Think about how you drive.
b. If you get into a conversation that seems to be over your pay scale, get help. (anything illegal, abuse, theological, intense battle with parents…)
c. Remember that you’re there generally as a partner with parents
d. Be very conscious about bringing parents in the loop. “Can I get a tattoo? Can I get this piercing? Can I go to this rated R movie? Those are questions only parents should answer.

Weekly Schedule
• Jump in and help
• Don’t be on the peripheral during activities. Model service and worship for the students. They learn more from what they see you do than what they hear you say.
• Find time to go to “big church”

End of school year email to adult leaders...

Lifegroup and 10:24 is over for the school year. What to do?

It’s a very common question. The most important point to remember is that relationship is not a program. Sure, we provide space for you to build relationships with students but just because the scheduled gathering has ended doesn’t mean your relationships end.

Some thoughts...

If you didn’t have a celebration last night you might want to go out for ice cream or something after this Sunday’s student led event. Talk about what God has done over the year.

Go to camp.

Show up on a Sunday night at least once a month over the summer. We don’t have life groups but your students are still around and would love to connect with you. (you’re welcome any time btw)

Go to camp.

Attend one of the special Wednesday night events.

Live on facebook. Yes it’s one of the easiest way to connect.

Go to camp.

Plan a summer outing with your group.

It’s been a phenomenal year of relational ministry. You have prayed, connected and invested in students this school year. It’s evident that God is continuing to do a unique work through our student ministry here at IBC. Thank you so much for your investment.

Did you ever know that you’re my hero?

David

Youth Ministry Unconference Wisconsin

Youth Ministry Unconference is a gathering of youth workers who dream, collaborate and discuss how to more effectively reach and deepen students. There is no celebrity, special speaker or expert who dominates. Well, I take that back, everyone who attends the event is an expert in their own way.

Each person who attended last week's Wisconsin unconference brought unique perspective and genius to the table. God has gifted Wisconsin with sharp and passionate youth workers. This conference format allows for each person's giftedness and experience to encourage and challenge others.

Some brief thoughts...

Many youth workers are burned out and need time away to reflect and decompress.

Youth workers seem to be beyond the glitz of events and long for the supernatural movement of God in their ministries.

There seems to be a powerful and beautiful "handoff" of youth ministry from the older generation to the next.

Youth workers love to be together and are incredibly fun.

We're still trying to figure out the best way to get students connected to Godly adult leaders.

Youth workers need each other.

Fried cheese curds are delicious.

Although I came back to Texas exhausted it was the good kind of exhaustion. I was encouraged, challenged and blessed to be a part of the conversation. It's also pretty cool to have some new friends in Wisconsin.

I would highly encourage you to host and or lead a youth ministry unconference in your area. It's a unique angle on equipping and encouraging youth ministry that is as effective as anything I've experienced in 20+ years of youth ministry. You and those who participate will walk away challenged, encouraged and better equipped. It's also a great way for each one who is there to humbly encourage and equip others.

To learn more check it out...

Youth Ministry Unconferences

You can also follow on twitter @ymunconference

At the Movies with Students Part 3

This is the third and final post on helping students think through movies, music and television. Messages from culture and media are more prominent today than ever before. Rarely do students unplug.

The word "amuse" is French and stems from the word "muse" which means "ponder" or "thought". The "a" negates thinking. So the word amuse basically means to be without thought or to simply put your brain in nuetral. We don't want students to simply be amused when they engage media. Our hope is they keep their thinking engaged as they interact with movies, television and music.

To help them better engage media there are seven questions we hope they will consider and utilize as they spend time watching or listening.

Here are the first 4...

1. Did I enjoy it. Why or Why not?

2. Does it teach anything about morality?

3. How does it portray authority?

4. Does it communicate anything about God?

You can check out the full posts at...

At the Movies with Students Part 1

At the Movies with Students Part 2

Now the final 3...

What is the "big point" in the movie, song or show?

Granted, not all media has a point but many times there is a theme, thought or philosophy that is highlighted. The other night I went to see "Thor". Not the greatest movie in the world, but I would say the strongest theme in the movie was that humility and teachability results in strength and wisdom. That's kind of a cool lesson to observe when perhaps going to watch what seems to be a thoughtless movie. Movies like "Crash", "No Strings Attached" and "The Kings Speech" all have strong central messages. It's fun and important to ask students, "what's that song actually about?" Same thing with movies and television. Most of the time they're not thinking about that because they've turned their brains off. We need to help them ask the right questions.

Can you find the "fingerprints of God"?

Most media is not directly about God but there are many examples that have echoes of his heart and plan. Again, "Thor". There are all kinds of references to sacrificial death and resurrection. Also, the strong theme of reconciliation with a father has God's fingerprints all over it.

The movie "127 Hours" is about a man who has an accident and has to take drastic measures to save his own life, but it's also about a person's independence and his admittance of his need for others. God made us communal and that truth comes out strong. I could go on but you get the drift. We need to help students sharpen their eyes and help them see that even people who don't now Jesus are made in the image of God and create media that reflects the deep longing of their heart which also often reflects the hand of God.

The final question,

What difference might this make in my life and the life of others?

Whether we like it or not, music, movies and television shape the lives of teens. Not every movie I've seen has impacted me, but many have. Some media opens the door for students to speak to other students about difficult issues. It's great when a show or song comes along that opens the door for conversation and reflection.

So there you have it. Some pretty simple questions to help them engage and avoid the temptation to simply be "amused". What are some questions I'm missing? If you serve students how do you help them fully engage and think through culture?

3 Reasons I Love Rob Bell

Ok, I realize the twitter flash is over and fewer people are talking about Rob Bell. After a month to reflect and the task of discussing "Love Wins" with our young adults next Thursday I wanted to share some short thoughts on why I love Rob and why I'm struggling with "Love Wins".

Here's the first reason to love Rob...

1. He's a gifted creative genius.

God has gifted Rob in incredible ways. Back in the day we used "nooma" videos to help students understand and engage with truth. I'm so grateful for his giftedness and willingness to try something new. The first video we ever used was the one on "fire". Do you remember how powerful that was? Or what about the video when he was hiking and had his son on his back. I can still remember him saying, "it's ok buddy". Powerful stuff.

2. He's not afraid to ask tough questions.

Our churches and communities must be places where people feel the freedom to question. Let's face it, there is a lot of stuff we believe that doesn't make sense. Many of the questions that come up in "Love Wins" are important things for us to consider. People are asking questions about heaven and hell. They're asking questions about God's goodness and human suffering. They're asking questions about grace and forgiveness. I long for my church to be a place where questions come frequently without the fear of others condemning.

I don't believe Rob is afraid to ask questions, do you?

3. He's my brother in Christ.

As I wrote that I felt so "oldschool", but it's true. Rob loves Jesus and Jesus loves Rob. People should absolutely desire what is God's best for Rob and his family. This passage in 1st Peter has really grabbed my heart lately.

1 Peter 1:22-23

22 Now that you have purified yourselves by obeying the truth so that you have sincere love for your brothers, love one another deeply, from the heart. 23 For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

When we obey the gospel we automatically and supernaturally have "sincere love for your brothers". Rob is one of those "brothers".

Although I love and respect Rob and his ministry I have significant struggles with "Love Wins".

Here are 3 quick thoughts.

1. He belittles his would be critics.

Many have said they love the book because it creates great discussion. Great discussion doesn't usually happen if you cut off those who disagree with you at the knees. His use of exaggeration and sarcasm may cause the reader to feel that if they question or believe something different than Rob perhaps they've "hijacked Christianity" or "don't throw very good parties". Perhaps instead of using verbiage like "if your God is loving one second and cruel the next" it might be better to seek to understand God's love as it relates also to his holiness, righteousness and justice. Is God cruel? No. Holy? Absolutely. That would be a discussion worth having.

I love what Tim Keller has said...

"The first thing that disappointed me was not the content so much as the attitude. There is an immediate ridicule of apparent “close-minded” people. A conversation about conflict cannot begin with ridicule. We should not pit the doctrines of God against one another. At the cross, the love and holiness of God both win."

Perhaps it's just me but I've always felt better conversations resulted when respecting the thoughts of critics instead of belittling them.

2. His use of scripture is at best incomplete.

I'm no Bible scholar and I don't have my doctorate in Greek but I really do have a passion to handle the scriptures well and look at the whole council of God. In my limited understanding it doesn't seem Rob does that well. Perhaps it was an oversight on my part but there seems to be important passages excluded. Of course he couldn't or wouldn't put all the Bible in his book but there are a couple that seem crucial to his discussion.

Does he anywhere mention the whole "narrow road" passage of Matthew 7? There's no doubt I could have missed it but Jesus seems to believe there will be a few saved.

The other major passage strangely missing is the "lamb's book of life" and "lake of fire" passage in Revelation 20:14, 15. That's some scary *%$^%# right there. Take a look if you have time.

Scot Mcknight has this to say about omitting Rev. 20...

"The first one is fatal for his argument because he said “And that’s it.” He does not discuss the Lake of Fire, and it appears to me that it cuts across his central arguments."

It would be interesting to see Rob's thoughts on these and other passages.

3. He is clearly unclear in his position.

Some people I've spoken with say the book is very clear on it's position. Others have said they have no idea what Rob's position is and what he's trying to say. My struggle is that he says things very strong and then throws in a "get out of jail free" card. Kind of like 'it would be dumb to believe that God judges sin for eternity" and then turning around and saying "I'm not really sure what happens". (my words not his)

He does however say this...

"Will everybody be saved, or will some perish apart from God forever because of their choices? Those are questions, or more accurately, those are tensions we are free to leave fully intact. We don’t need to resolve them or answer them because we can’t, and so we simply respect them, creating space for the freedom that love requires. (115)"

It's kind of like trying to nail jello to the wall. If he purposely is trying to be ambiguous he's done an ok job, maybe. I'm not sure. We can't know everything and there are many questions left unanswered. But when dealing with issues as important as a person's eternal destiny shouldn't we be as crystal clear as possible? Sometimes it feels he's purposely been as muddy as possible.

So, why is all this so important and why should we care? There are many answers to that question. Again, Tim Keller puts it well when asked if the discussion is important.

"Yes. It’s sort of like the bird in the ecosystem who if goes extinct throws off everything. Anything other than endless punishment lessens sin and the God who has been sinned against. If you take away the infinity of punishment, everything diminishes."

That's a strong statement and probably worth unpacking. The bottom line is this discussion on heaven and hell, God's holiness and his love is important and not going away. That's a good thing!

So, may we as people who love Jesus as the truth and learn to love and respect each other. Is it possible to love someone and also disagree with them? I sure hope so.